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Burnt ends
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  • Burnt ends

    Post #1 - January 10th, 2007, 4:51 pm
    Post #1 - January 10th, 2007, 4:51 pm Post #1 - January 10th, 2007, 4:51 pm
    My husband, from Kansas City, is desperatley missing burnt ends from Arthur Bryants. I tried, they don't ship, although they will send me the sauce. Any suggestions as to where I might find the best burnt ends in Chicago? [/b]
  • Post #2 - January 10th, 2007, 5:27 pm
    Post #2 - January 10th, 2007, 5:27 pm Post #2 - January 10th, 2007, 5:27 pm
    Sadly, nowhere. Burnt ends are a Kansas Cioty specialty that just aren't served anywhere else.
    Steve Z.

    “Only the pure in heart can make a good soup.”
    ― Ludwig van Beethoven
  • Post #3 - January 10th, 2007, 5:35 pm
    Post #3 - January 10th, 2007, 5:35 pm Post #3 - January 10th, 2007, 5:35 pm
    SteveZ,

    What about the trimmings from Honey 1? If they can be persuaded anyone really wants them. Heck we've been suggesting they would be the basis for excellent baked beans.

    Regards,
    Cathy2

    "You'll be remembered long after you're dead if you make good gravy, mashed potatoes and biscuits." -- Nathalie Dupree
    Facebook, Twitter, Greater Midwest Foodways, Road Food 2012: Podcast
  • Post #4 - January 10th, 2007, 5:50 pm
    Post #4 - January 10th, 2007, 5:50 pm Post #4 - January 10th, 2007, 5:50 pm
    Cathy2 wrote:What about the trimmings from Honey 1? If they can be persuaded anyone really wants them. Heck we've been suggesting they would be the basis for excellent baked beans.

    C2,

    Burnt ends, particularly in the context of Arthur Bryants/Kansas City, are brisket not pork. Though I agree, Honey 1's crisp and delicious outside (pork) shoulder is a rare treat and I dearly wish Robert Adam's would offer them for sale.

    As to the original question, I know of no brisket burnt ends for sale in the general Chicago area.

    Enjoy,
    Gary
    Last edited by G Wiv on January 10th, 2007, 6:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
    One minute to Wapner.
    Raymond Babbitt

    Low & Slow
  • Post #5 - January 10th, 2007, 6:05 pm
    Post #5 - January 10th, 2007, 6:05 pm Post #5 - January 10th, 2007, 6:05 pm
    There were a few fairly respectable burnt ends in the last brisket order I had from Smoque. That's as close as one is likely to get in these parts I think.
    Lacking fins or tail
    The Gefilte fish
    swims with great difficulty.

    Jewish haiku.
  • Post #6 - January 10th, 2007, 6:18 pm
    Post #6 - January 10th, 2007, 6:18 pm Post #6 - January 10th, 2007, 6:18 pm
    Cathy2 wrote:SteveZ,

    What about the trimmings from Honey 1? If they can be persuaded anyone really wants them. Heck we've been suggesting they would be the basis for excellent baked beans.

    Regards,


    Those are tasty, but burnt ends are beef, not pork.
    Steve Z.

    “Only the pure in heart can make a good soup.”
    ― Ludwig van Beethoven
  • Post #7 - January 10th, 2007, 6:23 pm
    Post #7 - January 10th, 2007, 6:23 pm Post #7 - January 10th, 2007, 6:23 pm
    kuhdo wrote:There were a few fairly respectable burnt ends in the last brisket order I had from Smoque. That's as close as one is likely to get in these parts I think.


    Kuhdo,

    I think you are confusing the well done edges (bark) of Smoque's brisket with burnt ends. Here's what the OP is talking about.

    Exhibit A (Lil Jakes)
    Image

    Exhibit B (LC's)
    Image
    Steve Z.

    “Only the pure in heart can make a good soup.”
    ― Ludwig van Beethoven
  • Post #8 - January 10th, 2007, 7:13 pm
    Post #8 - January 10th, 2007, 7:13 pm Post #8 - January 10th, 2007, 7:13 pm
    I know it's not the most popular place in the forum... but Uncle Bub's in Westmont does have burnt ends, and I would venture to say that it's probably the reason I actually go there. For 3.99 you get a decent "Add On" portion.. nice smoky caramelized meat, and very very tender

    http://unclebubs.com/Menu/Uncle_Bubs_Menu.pdf
  • Post #9 - January 10th, 2007, 10:01 pm
    Post #9 - January 10th, 2007, 10:01 pm Post #9 - January 10th, 2007, 10:01 pm
    http://www.jackstackbbq.com has them and they will ship.
  • Post #10 - January 10th, 2007, 10:04 pm
    Post #10 - January 10th, 2007, 10:04 pm Post #10 - January 10th, 2007, 10:04 pm
    I thought the burnt ends and the charred edges were actually the same at least originally. My understanding was, every time you bbq a brisket, you get some burnt ends. You can go ahead and cook up some brisket aiming to make it all into burnt ends, so that people who like that part of the brisket best can get the whole order like that, but in effect that's just imitating what happens naturally to parts of the bark when you do a good job bbqing in the first place. This is not true?
    Lacking fins or tail
    The Gefilte fish
    swims with great difficulty.

    Jewish haiku.
  • Post #11 - January 10th, 2007, 10:39 pm
    Post #11 - January 10th, 2007, 10:39 pm Post #11 - January 10th, 2007, 10:39 pm
    kuhdo wrote:I thought the burnt ends and the charred edges were actually the same at least originally. My understanding was, every time you bbq a brisket, you get some burnt ends. You can go ahead and cook up some brisket aiming to make it all into burnt ends, so that people who like that part of the brisket best can get the whole order like that, but in effect that's just imitating what happens naturally to parts of the bark when you do a good job bbqing in the first place. This is not true?


    This is more or less true, but the technique used at Smoque does not produce enough of this brown food of the Gods to count as burnt ends...and they don't offer them in any event.
    Steve Z.

    “Only the pure in heart can make a good soup.”
    ― Ludwig van Beethoven
  • Post #12 - January 10th, 2007, 11:34 pm
    Post #12 - January 10th, 2007, 11:34 pm Post #12 - January 10th, 2007, 11:34 pm
    I wonder if they could be induced to do so?
    Lacking fins or tail
    The Gefilte fish
    swims with great difficulty.

    Jewish haiku.
  • Post #13 - January 11th, 2007, 12:46 am
    Post #13 - January 11th, 2007, 12:46 am Post #13 - January 11th, 2007, 12:46 am
    Artie wrote:http://www.jackstackbbq.com has them and they will ship.


    Most of the burnt ends on that site are pork.

    I had never heard of them before, and the photos are making me drool! However, the prices seem ridiculous to me....$140 plus shipping for a slab of ribs, a pound each of wings, pork burnt ends, and sausage, some beans, and a jar of sauce? No thanks.
  • Post #14 - January 11th, 2007, 1:23 pm
    Post #14 - January 11th, 2007, 1:23 pm Post #14 - January 11th, 2007, 1:23 pm
    Although burnt ends started out as strictly brisket, (Arthur Bryant's used to give 'em away; piled up in a trough near the cash register, you'd grab a handful as you payed your bill. Better than a fishbowl full of mints, eh?), the demand has risen so dramatically that most Kansas City places now serve the dish as a combination of both pork and beef.

    For whatever it's worth, the plate of Arthur Bryant's burnt ends that we consumed while visiting over the Holidays was very disappointing. Far too much sauce overwhelmed the flavor and texture of the meat resulting in something that was more like an overcooked Barbecue Beef Stew. I hope this was a one time occurence and not a trend.

    Buddy
  • Post #15 - January 11th, 2007, 1:38 pm
    Post #15 - January 11th, 2007, 1:38 pm Post #15 - January 11th, 2007, 1:38 pm
    bellringr wrote:
    Artie wrote:http://www.jackstackbbq.com has them and they will ship.


    Most of the burnt ends on that site are pork.

    I had never heard of them before, and the photos are making me drool! However, the prices seem ridiculous to me....$140 plus shipping for a slab of ribs, a pound each of wings, pork burnt ends, and sausage, some beans, and a jar of sauce? No thanks.


    My sister lives in KC, and raves about this place. My dad went there to visit last month and loved the place as well. It's quite well known in KC.
  • Post #16 - January 11th, 2007, 2:47 pm
    Post #16 - January 11th, 2007, 2:47 pm Post #16 - January 11th, 2007, 2:47 pm
    Jack's Stack is part of the Fiorella Family Barbecue Empire in Kansas City. They've just opened up a location on The Plaza taking over the space once occupied by the KC Masterpiece restaurant. In addition to the Plaza location and the one in Overland Park, Kansas; the family has also owned Smoke Stack Bar-B-Q of Martin City (MO). Although other Fiorella family members have owned other joints called "Smoke Stack" or some variation on the name, none of them were related business-wise to the original Martin City location.

    Their specialty has been lamb ribs; a cut that no one else in KC serves. They are also known for their cheesy corn bake and gigantic onion rings served staked up on a spindle.

    As KC 'Que joints go, the Smoke Stack/Jack's Stack operate outside the norm of the typical "Greasehouse". Rather than formica tables and throw away plates and flatware, the Fiorella's have opted for white tablecloths and better than average silverware. To quote Ardie Davis' Kansas City BBQ Pocket Guide:

    "There is Generic Greasehouse and there is Greasehouse Elegance. Smoke Stack definitely exemplifies the latter. The symphony of wood-paneled walls, Victorian floral print paper, brass fixtures, lamps, ceiling fans, porcelain and porcine artifacts make Smoke Stack elegant but not arrogant. You can eat 'Que here in bib overalls and a gimme cap or tails and a top hat and not look out of place."

    In all the years we've been going to KC (Mrs. Roadhouse's hometown), we have never been to Jack's Stack in Overland Park. Given the Fiorella family's history though, I suspect it strongly resembles the original Martin City outlet (Which we have visited several times).

    Buddy
  • Post #17 - January 11th, 2007, 3:15 pm
    Post #17 - January 11th, 2007, 3:15 pm Post #17 - January 11th, 2007, 3:15 pm
    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:Although burnt ends started out as strictly brisket, (Arthur Bryant's used to give 'em away; piled up in a trough near the cash register, you'd grab a handful as you payed your bill. Better than a fishbowl full of mints, eh?), the demand has risen so dramatically that most Kansas City places now serve the dish as a combination of both pork and beef.

    For whatever it's worth, the plate of Arthur Bryant's burnt ends that we consumed while visiting over the Holidays was very disappointing. Far too much sauce overwhelmed the flavor and texture of the meat resulting in something that was more like an overcooked Barbecue Beef Stew. I hope this was a one time occurence and not a trend.

    Buddy


    Buddy,

    I'm not a fan of the present day Bryant's burnt ends. They have become too popular and "they don't make 'em like they used to." My 2 favorite KC places for burnt ends are Lil' Jakes and LC's, both of which I have pictured above. I've tried the BE in all the usual suspects and these two are the only ones I bother ordering any more.
    Steve Z.

    “Only the pure in heart can make a good soup.”
    ― Ludwig van Beethoven
  • Post #18 - January 11th, 2007, 5:56 pm
    Post #18 - January 11th, 2007, 5:56 pm Post #18 - January 11th, 2007, 5:56 pm
    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:Their specialty has been lamb ribs; a cut that no one else in KC serves.


    While I know Jack Stack is known for this offering (and I found it pretty good, but I'll order something else if there's a next time), I've seen it elsewhere too. A couple nights ago, for example, it was on special at RJ's Bob-e-que on Johnson Drive in Mission.

    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:"There is Generic Greasehouse and there is Greasehouse Elegance. Smoke Stack definitely exemplifies the latter...."


    I've only been to the Overland Park location, and "Greasehouse Elegance" makes the location sound like it has more character than I found it too. Didn't strike me as much different than any of the other suburban chain restaurants that dominate the Johnson County dining landscape.

    I did like the sides at Jack Stack.
  • Post #19 - January 11th, 2007, 6:37 pm
    Post #19 - January 11th, 2007, 6:37 pm Post #19 - January 11th, 2007, 6:37 pm
    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:Although other Fiorella family members have owned other joints called "Smoke Stack" or some variation on the name, none of them were related business-wise to the original Martin City location.

    Their specialty has been lamb ribs; a cut that no one else in KC serves. They are also known for their cheesy corn bake and gigantic onion rings served staked up on a spindle.


    If you mean Smokestack, they specialize in more than just the so-so lamb ribs.
    Steve Z.

    “Only the pure in heart can make a good soup.”
    ― Ludwig van Beethoven
  • Post #20 - January 11th, 2007, 7:49 pm
    Post #20 - January 11th, 2007, 7:49 pm Post #20 - January 11th, 2007, 7:49 pm
    Steve, I believe the Smokestack you are refering to is one of the "other" Smokestack restaurants owned by "other" members of the Fiorella family. The best known location, until recently, was the Martin City outlet at 13441 Holmes.

    As for the deficiency in Arthur Bryant's burnt ends, you'll get no argument from me, at least as of the last serving I consumed. We only get in there once every one or two years so I'm not a good judge of consistency. Also, I would agree that LC's serves a superior burnt ends plate to almost any I have had in 28 years of visiting my wife's beloved hometown of Kansas City.

    Aaron Deacon, you are correct that there are a few other places that serve lamb ribs in KC. In fact if I recall correctly they were on special at RJ's the night we were there with a large group just before New Year's Eve. However, Smokestack Bar-B-Q of Martin City has hung there hat on their lamb ribs in an effort to make them "famous". Further, there is no other place in KC that I am aware of that has them as a regular menu item versus the occasional special.

    As for the "Greasehouse Elegance" those were Ardie's words for the Martin City location. When his Kansas City BBQ Pocket Guide was published in the mid '90s, JackStack in Overland Park did not even exist yet. As I have not yet visited the OP location, and as I was familiar with the MC spot I assumed (perhaps mistakenly) that the decor in the new location was similar to the original.

    Just as an aside to all of this, we discovered what I will predict is the next "in spot" for 'Que in KC, a place called Woodyard BBQ on the Kansas side. They are by no means new, having been around for decades as a wood supplier to all the other BBQ joints in town. It is only within the last few years however that they have been operating as restaurant.

    So far I have only sampled their ribs and smoked salmon along with a few of their side dishes, but what I've had has been outstanding. Keep an eye on Woodyard and give 'em a try next time you're in town.

    Buddy
  • Post #21 - January 11th, 2007, 10:02 pm
    Post #21 - January 11th, 2007, 10:02 pm Post #21 - January 11th, 2007, 10:02 pm
    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:Just as an aside to all of this, we discovered what I will predict is the next "in spot" for 'Que in KC, a place called Woodyard BBQ on the Kansas side.


    A friend of mine used to live nearby in Lenexa. I've been there once and I'll agree that they turn out a pretty good slab of ribs. I can't remember anything about the sides, but the place, being in the middle of a huge yard of cut logs, is very cool. At least they won't run out of fuel.
    Steve Z.

    “Only the pure in heart can make a good soup.”
    ― Ludwig van Beethoven
  • Post #22 - January 12th, 2007, 9:46 am
    Post #22 - January 12th, 2007, 9:46 am Post #22 - January 12th, 2007, 9:46 am
    bellringr wrote:
    Artie wrote:http://www.jackstackbbq.com has them and they will ship.


    Most of the burnt ends on that site are pork.


    I've tried them twice via FedEx overnight and they weren't particularly good in any case. They were a real disappointment, in fact, just like the stuff that I've tried from Arthur Bryant's most recently.

    In all honesty, the only Fiorella's Jack Stack overnight item that I've ever really gotten excited about is the "cheesy corn bake."

    E.M.
  • Post #23 - January 12th, 2007, 10:24 am
    Post #23 - January 12th, 2007, 10:24 am Post #23 - January 12th, 2007, 10:24 am
    Erik M. wrote:
    I've tried them twice via FedEx overnight and they weren't particularly good in any case. They were a real disappointment, in fact, just like the stuff that I've tried from Arthur Bryant's most recently.

    In all honesty, the only Fiorella's Jack Stack overnight item that I've ever really gotten excited about is the "cheesy corn bake."

    E.M.


    I get a gift package of them every year around Christmas but in all honesty
    if the giver decided on something else I wouldn't be all that disappointed. I do like their sausage and especially their BBQ Sauce.
  • Post #24 - January 12th, 2007, 12:25 pm
    Post #24 - January 12th, 2007, 12:25 pm Post #24 - January 12th, 2007, 12:25 pm
    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:However, Smokestack Bar-B-Q of Martin City has hung there hat on their lamb ribs in an effort to make them "famous". Further, there is no other place in KC that I am aware of that has them as a regular menu item versus the occasional special.


    I'm not sure of the Smokestack/Jack Stack distinction, but I would say that about 90% of the time I hear about lamb ribs, it's in the context of Jack Stack. The Jack Stack website doesn't seem to differentiate the Martin City location from the other three, but that may have changed during the Jack Stack corporate expansion. I'll have to check it out sometime.

    BuddyRoadhouse wrote:Just as an aside to all of this, we discovered what I will predict is the next "in spot" for 'Que in KC, a place called Woodyard BBQ on the Kansas side. They are by no means new, having been around for decades as a wood supplier to all the other BBQ joints in town. It is only within the last few years however that they have been operating as restaurant.
    ...
    Keep an eye on Woodyard and give 'em a try next time you're in town.


    Hey, I'm always in town. Thanks for the tip.
  • Post #25 - January 12th, 2007, 7:08 pm
    Post #25 - January 12th, 2007, 7:08 pm Post #25 - January 12th, 2007, 7:08 pm
    Aaron, I'd love to hear what you think of Woodyard! Be aware they are only open for lunch; 'til 5pm, I believe.

    Buddy
  • Post #26 - January 23rd, 2007, 10:33 pm
    Post #26 - January 23rd, 2007, 10:33 pm Post #26 - January 23rd, 2007, 10:33 pm
    This is an "unofficial" tip for navigating a successful lunch at Arthur Bryant's: Tip your cook. While this does not necessarily get you a bigger sandwich, burnt ends, etc., it does get you Quality. Those guys are going to use all of a very large-sized smoker literally filled with brisket during their shift. If you provide an economic incentive to make your sandwich just a hint better than the average consumer, then you will not be disappointed. I have personally experienced this fact. Palm your order-taker $2 (If dining alone) or $5 (for more than 1), and you will experience the best KC can offer. Especially the "ends", but also with brisket, there are prime pieces of meat and there is luck-of-the-draw. Especially when entertaining (customers, out-of-town friends), I like to take the luck factor away.

    Look at it this way: at a normal restaurant, you tip your server because he/she gave you good service. At AB's, pay that up front with the guy that controls your dining experience.

    In light of full disclosure, I am not the biggest fan of Bryant's sauce (more of a Gates man), but their burnt ends are STILL worth the trip. Absolutely no substitute, but also interesting are the burnt ends at Jack Stack.

    Also, one newbie question: what is this thread doing on this site? Highjacked, indeed.
  • Post #27 - February 2nd, 2007, 8:09 pm
    Post #27 - February 2nd, 2007, 8:09 pm Post #27 - February 2nd, 2007, 8:09 pm
    Man, you guys are KILLIN' me! I'm up here on my Montreal phase of living, and there's not a decent slab within maybe 1000 miles. Really. Much as I just fabuluously love Montreal, like I said, there's not a rib in sight. And SuperBowl's coming up in two (count 'em *2*) days. A trip to Costco tomorrow morning should get me the ribs, but my real smoker is in KC; I've just got the bottom half of a bullet here. But I'll get it done, really I will!

    Meanwhile, y'awl enjoy your KC delectables. Don't forget the beans at Martin City 'Stack, and the pulled pork at Okie Joe's.

    On you Bears!

    Geo
    Sooo, you like wine and are looking for something good to read? Maybe *this* will do the trick! :)
  • Post #28 - February 2nd, 2007, 8:13 pm
    Post #28 - February 2nd, 2007, 8:13 pm Post #28 - February 2nd, 2007, 8:13 pm
    Geo wrote:Man, you guys are KILLIN' me! I'm up here on my Montreal phase of living, and there's not a decent slab within maybe 1000 miles. Really.


    Never been, but if 435km is close enough, you could give Curtis BBQ in Putney, Vermont a try :)
    Ed Fisher
    my chicago food photos

    RIP LTH.
  • Post #29 - February 3rd, 2007, 7:31 am
    Post #29 - February 3rd, 2007, 7:31 am Post #29 - February 3rd, 2007, 7:31 am
    Buddyroadhouse just described how to obtain the burnt ends experience at Smoque:

    Tonight's entry was more reflective of the comments from those folks who suffered through tough and dry. It wasn't that bad mind you, but it wasn't in the same league with the stuff I was served on my first visit. This was still flavorful brisket served in an abundant portion. It just wasn't up to the same standard as my first time around.

    And then I noticed that the pieces I had been served were from the tip of the brisket, that narrow end with much less fat than the thicker end. you know that part of the brisket that a typical Kansas City greasehouse would use for Burnt Ends...Hey wait a minute! That's how you turn a negative into a positive! Take those tough dry "burnt" ends and soak 'em in sauce for a few hours and serve them as a new menu item!

    I tried a very unscientific experiment in my take-out clamshell and poured a quantity of sauce over the thick slices of beef lying within. I left them sit for a few minutes and voila, near perfect Burnt Ends! Imagine how good they could be if you were trying to create Burnt Ends on purpose! After all, what may not be your best foot forward when presented as a regular old brisket platter, when treated properly, can actually be an outstanding foundation for a plate of burnt ends.


    Who knew it could be that easy?

    Regards,
    Cathy2

    "You'll be remembered long after you're dead if you make good gravy, mashed potatoes and biscuits." -- Nathalie Dupree
    Facebook, Twitter, Greater Midwest Foodways, Road Food 2012: Podcast
  • Post #30 - February 3rd, 2007, 8:46 am
    Post #30 - February 3rd, 2007, 8:46 am Post #30 - February 3rd, 2007, 8:46 am
    Geo wrote:Don't forget the beans at Martin City 'Stack, and the pulled pork at Okie Joe's.


    Do you find the beans at the Martin City location markedly better than those at the others. I enjoy Jack Stack's sides well enough, but probably not enough for a special trip. And my first trip to Martin City is more likely to be to sample Jess and Jim's.

    I thought the pulled port at Oklahoma Joe's was okay, but a little on the bland side, and they use liquid smoke in their sauce.

    I prefer the pulled pork at the nearby RJ's, whose killer country-style breakfast on weekends is worthy of its own post.

    By the way, a more detail on Woodyard can be found over here.

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