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Steigl's Grapefruit Radler and my Intro to Beer

Steigl's Grapefruit Radler and my Intro to Beer
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  • Steigl's Grapefruit Radler and my Intro to Beer

    Post #1 - August 16th, 2012, 9:06 am
    Post #1 - August 16th, 2012, 9:06 am Post #1 - August 16th, 2012, 9:06 am
    Has anyone tried this? It sounds delicious, and I thought it might make a nice start for my introduction to the world of beer. I was tempted to try it at a restaurant yesterday, but I didn't want to pay $7 for something I might hate.

    Mr. Pie tried a peach wheat beer the other day that I liked, but Leine's Summer Shandy tasted like Pledge to me.
    Last edited by Pie Lady on August 16th, 2012, 11:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
    I want to have a good body, but not as much as I want dessert. ~ Jason Love

    There is no pie in Nighthawks, which is why it's such a desolate image. ~ Happy Stomach

    I write stuff.
  • Post #2 - August 16th, 2012, 10:00 am
    Post #2 - August 16th, 2012, 10:00 am Post #2 - August 16th, 2012, 10:00 am
    I went through a couple 6-packs of this stuff during last month's hot weather. It's delicious.

    I wouldn't consider it to be a good candidate for an "introduction to the world of beer", as it barely tastes like beer (other than a very slight malty/beery thing going on in the background)...but if you're a fan of grapefruit sodas, it'll be right up your alley.

    And yeah, that Dogfish Head Festina Pêche is very tasty.
  • Post #3 - August 16th, 2012, 10:05 am
    Post #3 - August 16th, 2012, 10:05 am Post #3 - August 16th, 2012, 10:05 am
    I thought it would be a good choice, since I don't like beer. I do like grapefruit soda. Does anyone sell these by the single bottle?

    Dogfish Head...that's the one. Great stuff.

    What would you suggest for an introduction to the world of beer?
    I want to have a good body, but not as much as I want dessert. ~ Jason Love

    There is no pie in Nighthawks, which is why it's such a desolate image. ~ Happy Stomach

    I write stuff.
  • Post #4 - August 16th, 2012, 10:55 am
    Post #4 - August 16th, 2012, 10:55 am Post #4 - August 16th, 2012, 10:55 am
    You might try this to see where you can find it on draft or by the bottle: http://www.beermenus.com/beers/stiegl-radler-grapefruit

    Within city limits, be warned -- it's uncommon to find many beers sold in individual 12oz. bottles. Something about it being illegal to break up packaging from the manufacturer (ie. if the manufacturer puts it in a 6-pack, it better be sold in a 6-pack). There are ways around this and Binny's offers up a make-your-own 6-pack, though the available bottles for this make-your-own are of a limited selection.

    Anyway! What is it about beer that you don't like? Which have you tried and what did you not like about them? One beer that seems to impress people who normally don't like beer is Sofie, from Goose Island. It's very effervescent and has really strong citrus notes. I don't find it as bitter as most beer, nor quite as malty.
    best,
    dan
  • Post #5 - August 16th, 2012, 11:04 am
    Post #5 - August 16th, 2012, 11:04 am Post #5 - August 16th, 2012, 11:04 am
    danimalarkey wrote:You might try this to see where you can find it on draft or by the bottle: http://www.beermenus.com/beers/stiegl-radler-grapefruit

    Within city limits, be warned -- it's uncommon to find many beers sold in individual 12oz. bottles. Something about it being illegal to break up packaging from the manufacturer (ie. if the manufacturer puts it in a 6-pack, it better be sold in a 6-pack). There are ways around this and Binny's offers up a make-your-own 6-pack, though the available bottles for this make-your-own are of a limited selection.

    Anyway! What is it about beer that you don't like? Which have you tried and what did you not like about them? One beer that seems to impress people who normally don't like beer is Sofie, from Goose Island. It's very effervescent and has really strong citrus notes. I don't find it as bitter as most beer, nor quite as malty.


    That website is so cool! Thanks!

    The thing I don't like about beer is the bitterness and that gasoline taste a lot of them have. I don't know if that's the malt or the hops or what. If I had to have beer, I'd pick a Blue Moon or the Dogfish Head Pesche mentioned above. Guinness isn't bad but it's more a meal than a drink. I know I don't like Old Style or anything like it.
    I want to have a good body, but not as much as I want dessert. ~ Jason Love

    There is no pie in Nighthawks, which is why it's such a desolate image. ~ Happy Stomach

    I write stuff.
  • Post #6 - August 16th, 2012, 11:16 am
    Post #6 - August 16th, 2012, 11:16 am Post #6 - August 16th, 2012, 11:16 am
    Have you tried any lambics? New Glarus makes a cherry lambic that's really tasty and leans more towards a sweet wine flavor than a beer flavor.

    Of course New Glarus doesn't distribute to Illinois but you can find Lindemans lambics in a lot of liqour stores. They have various berry flavored ones that are pretty tasty if you like sweet beer. These are all sold in larger "bomber" bottles that you buy individually.
  • Post #7 - August 16th, 2012, 11:20 am
    Post #7 - August 16th, 2012, 11:20 am Post #7 - August 16th, 2012, 11:20 am
    gorack wrote:Have you tried any lambics? New Glarus makes a cherry lambic that's really tasty and leans more towards a sweet wine flavor than a beer flavor.

    Probably, but I couldn't tell one beer type from another. I could swear I've seen New Glarus stuff recently, possibly at the Jewel on Touhy. Aren't they the ones with the thumbprint of Wisconsin on their bottlecaps?
    Last edited by Pie Lady on August 16th, 2012, 11:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
    I want to have a good body, but not as much as I want dessert. ~ Jason Love

    There is no pie in Nighthawks, which is why it's such a desolate image. ~ Happy Stomach

    I write stuff.
  • Post #8 - August 16th, 2012, 11:27 am
    Post #8 - August 16th, 2012, 11:27 am Post #8 - August 16th, 2012, 11:27 am
    Yes, I've never seen any of their stuff at a liqour store in Illinios I don't think. That's strange if they have it at Jewel.
  • Post #9 - August 16th, 2012, 12:10 pm
    Post #9 - August 16th, 2012, 12:10 pm Post #9 - August 16th, 2012, 12:10 pm
    It sounds like hops definitely aren't your thing (and possibly malt as well). It sounds like you're on the right track with trying fruit beers, and wheat beers would definitely be worth a shot as well. If you're feeling adventurous check out some Sour beers too.

    I can't recommend the Stiegl Grapefruit enough - just plain great stuff in hot weather. The Lemon is also excellent and is available in large single bottles. For Lambics Lindeman's is very easy to find, and is also a good point of reference when describing tastes you like and don't like. Their Framboise (raspberry) is excellent, and they also make very good cherry (Kriek), peach (Pecheresse), currant (Cassis), and apple (Pomme). They also do a straight up Lambic - Geuze Cuvée René. Pyramid makes a decent apricot beer that is pretty easy to find as well.

    You might also like some beer based drinks, the Shandy at Longman & Eagle and the Publican "beermosa" are both great summer drinks.
    It is VERY important to be smart when you're doing something stupid

    - Chris

    http://stavewoodworking.com
  • Post #10 - August 16th, 2012, 1:42 pm
    Post #10 - August 16th, 2012, 1:42 pm Post #10 - August 16th, 2012, 1:42 pm
    It might be worth visiting the Goose Island brewpub off Clybourn Ave. and ordering a flight (or two). Now, in general, I don't really like the beer they make much these days (half the taps, roughly, are used for beer made on-site while the other half is for stuff made from the separately-owned facility on Fulton Ave.), but they do make a wide variety. And all summer long, they've been using fruit from Green City Market to make beer -- the most recent was "Belgian Peche" is a Belgian pale ale with a peach aroma and apricot flavor. (5.8%)". But by getting a flight, you're only get small samples of a variety of styles to help better narrow in on what you like and dislike.

    I wonder if a hefeweizen would be something you'd enjoy? Low on the hops (relatively speaking), though possibly too malty. For me, some hefe's run a little heavy on the banana aroma, but others are more citrusy. 312 bills itself as a wheat ale, but I don't know if you'd like it. Gumballhead, by Three Floyds, is another wheat ale, but that's pretty hard to find these days.
    best,
    dan
  • Post #11 - August 16th, 2012, 1:51 pm
    Post #11 - August 16th, 2012, 1:51 pm Post #11 - August 16th, 2012, 1:51 pm
    I sometimes like fruit beers, here's a few to try

    O'Fallon Wheach
    Leinenkugel Berry Weiss
    Sam Adams winter blackberry
    Wild Blue blueberry lager
    Wild Red rasperry lager
    Dogfish head Aprihop (not real fruity, pretty hoppy)
  • Post #12 - August 16th, 2012, 2:54 pm
    Post #12 - August 16th, 2012, 2:54 pm Post #12 - August 16th, 2012, 2:54 pm
    You won't find New Glarus in Illinois unless they've changed up their distribution model recently. They've pretty much stuck to Wisconsin.

    At the Pub we'll introduce folks into the wonderful world of craft beers with selections like, Scrimshaw from North Coast Brewing, Supper Club or Island Wheat from Capital Island, and closer to home Ebel's Weiss from Two Brothers and the already mentioned, Sofie from Goose Island. All are very "light" yet with the character and depth one expects in a craft beer.

    Also, if you want to enter into the fruit beers, or lambics, Lindeman has several interesting offerings Pomme (to me it's like drinking a green apple Jolly Rancher though), Peche, and Framboise. One of the best fruit flavored beers I have ran across in the last few years is a summer only offering from R.J. Rockers called "Son of a Peach". A nice American style pale ale that held a nose of freshly sliced peaches, yet a brew that let you know you were in fact still drinking a nice beer.
    D.G. Sullivan's, "we're a little bit Irish, and a whole lot of fun"!
  • Post #13 - August 16th, 2012, 3:04 pm
    Post #13 - August 16th, 2012, 3:04 pm Post #13 - August 16th, 2012, 3:04 pm
    My wife for years claimed not to like beer and just in the past year or two has found some styles she likes. Your description of what you don't like in beer sounds almost exactly like her dislikes, so I thought I'd share some styles she's enjoyed.

    Her favorites are definitely Belgian sours like Monk's Cafe, Bellegems Oud Bruin or Bockor Jacobin Rouge and fruit lambics like those mentioned above. She also likes saisons like Saison Dupont or Ommegang Hennepin.

    [Edit to add: The thing with the sours is that they're definitely sour. They don't tend to have much bitterness at all and are generally fairly balanced with sweetness, but there is a definite sour taste there. It's more the kind of rich sour you get in a good balsamic vinegar than a bright lemon juice sour. I'm definitely not trying to turn you off of them; I think they're great, I just don't want you to be surprised.]

    If you like Blue Moon, you could try some other witbiers like Hoegaarden, Allagash White or Unibroue Blanche de Chambly.
  • Post #14 - August 16th, 2012, 8:25 pm
    Post #14 - August 16th, 2012, 8:25 pm Post #14 - August 16th, 2012, 8:25 pm
    Yeah, New Glarus, as far as I know, is still solely sold in Wisconsin and do not have any public plans to expand their distribution. I have seen it in Illinois at a liquor store, but it was, how shall I put this, not an official product, and only was there for a week. (But it was in the regular beer cooler.)

    Steigl's Grapefruit Radler tastes like grapefruit soda. I don't really detect any beer flavor in it, and it's about 2.5% alc. But it's a nice grapefruit flavor, not too artificial tasting and not too sweet. It is very nice for a summer's day.

    Based on you liking some wheat beers and Guinness and your general distaste for bitterness, I assume it's mostly the hops that you don't like. (Also, while Guinnesss has a reputation for being a "meal," it's a relatively low-calorie beer at 125 calories per 12 fl. oz. That's less alcohol than an Old Style, and the same as a Michelob Light, believe it or not.)

    I would definitely second the recommendation of going to Goose Island or similar brewpub and ordering a flight of beers to get an idea of what different styles taste like. Also, remember that at most places, you can ask for a taste of beer if you're unfamiliar with it. I've never asked for more than two or three tastes before deciding on a beer, but in a beer-centric bar, the staff there are more than happy to match you with a beer you might enjoy.

    I suspect that you should be able to find something in the Belgian beers that you like. Belgian beers tend not to be hoppy, emphasizing more malty and yeasty flavors (which tend to be banana-y or clove-y). They are more "complex" in a certain way, as they don't have a tradition of beer purity laws, so you can find all sorts of spices, fruit, candy sugar, etc., in their beers, depending on which style you go for.

    I would try the following, easy to source beers.

    Goose Island 312. This is a light, American wheat beer. Low on hops, low on the yeasty flavor of German and Belgian wheat beers, refreshing. I didn't like this one the first few times I had it, wanting it to be much more yeasty, but I've grown to enjoy the style. My favorite example of American Wheats is Bell's Oberon. Also worth trying if you want something with a little more flavor than the 312.

    Hacker-Pschorr Hefe Weisse. A German wheat beer. Wheat beers can be love-it-or-hate-it beers, but it seems you enjoy the wheats, so I'll keep going in this direction. It's going to be a lot fuller in flavor than the 312, a little bit cloudy, and has a distinctive yeasty taste that brings bananas to mind.

    Hoegaarden. Continuing with the wheats going the Belgian direction. This is a Belgian wheat beer brewed with coriander seeds and curacao orange peels. Light in color, cloudy, yeasty (clove-like). This is the beer style (witbier) that Blue Moon is based on. I'm not a big fan of Blue Moon, but I like Hoegaarden. Might be worth a taste

    Samuel Smith Nut Brown Ale. This recommendation is a little bit of guess, but since you like Guinness, and it's a bit heavy for you, a brown ale might be more to your liking. Low in hops, with a roasted nuttiness in the malt. I'm personally not big on the brown ale style, but this is a good beer and I've discovered it to work well with people who don't typically like beer.

    New Belgium Fat Tire. I actually dislike this beer, but I think you might like it based on your description. Once again, a crowd-pleaser, light in hops, medium/medium-light body. It's got a pleasant, caramel/toffee sweetness to it. I personally find the flavor a bit too cereal-y for my tastes, but it is a solid beer.

    Now I'm going to go in a completely different direction:

    St. Bernardus Abt 12 (or Rochefort Trappistes 10). These are both very heavy, highly alcoholic beers (at about 10.5-11.5%). This is a recommendation if you want a beer that is more like a complex, heavy red wine than something to quaff on a hot summer day. Malty, sweet, fruity, yeasty, with flavors that remind me of currants, berries, raisins. Mouthfeel is a bit thick, carbonation is quite low. I'd even describe these beers as port-like. Very different than what you think of as beer, which is why I'm taking a shot in the dark with this recommendation.

    The basic fruit beer recs have been made, but I'll point out, if you are in Wisconsin, do pick up New Glarus's Raspberry Tart or their Belgian Red (the sour cherry one.) These are AMAZING fruit beers. Just incredible. I didn't think I liked fruit beers until I had both of these. They just have an incredible freshness of fruit flavor to them. Lindeman's lambics taste more like pop than beer to me (plus they are artificially sweetened with Ace K--at least that's what listed on the European labels.) Oh, and New Glarus's apple offering is equally wonderful.
  • Post #15 - August 16th, 2012, 8:52 pm
    Post #15 - August 16th, 2012, 8:52 pm Post #15 - August 16th, 2012, 8:52 pm
    If it's really the hops you don't like, try a gruit. It was the style of beer before hops became popular, and today Founders, New Holland and Great Lakes (among others) have been known to make gruits.

    Or you might want to try a sahti - Goose Island and Sam Adams have been known to brew it, although its origins are Finnish - you might be able to find an imported version.

    Sahtis and gruits might be hard to find, but if you're intent on avoiding beers with hops, they're probably your best bet.
  • Post #16 - August 17th, 2012, 9:09 am
    Post #16 - August 17th, 2012, 9:09 am Post #16 - August 17th, 2012, 9:09 am
    Thanks for the suggestions, guys! I'll have to persuade my hubby to take me out for a beer run this weekend. I'm going to write all these down so I don't forget.

    Binko-Sam Smith's Nut Brown is the hubby's favorite beer. It's pretty good.

    nr706 - I never heard of sahtis and gruits. Where have you seen them? According to the website listed higher up, I can find a Sahti at a liquor store on Augusta near Western, but the nearest gruit is 123 miles away.
    I want to have a good body, but not as much as I want dessert. ~ Jason Love

    There is no pie in Nighthawks, which is why it's such a desolate image. ~ Happy Stomach

    I write stuff.
  • Post #17 - August 17th, 2012, 10:37 am
    Post #17 - August 17th, 2012, 10:37 am Post #17 - August 17th, 2012, 10:37 am
    Binko-Sam Smith's Nut Brown is the hubby's favorite beer. It's pretty good.


    OK, with this favorable opinion of the nut brown, and your opinions of Guinness and Blue Moon, it doesn't sound at all like you don't like beer. It's just a matter of finding the style that most suits your tastes. While Steigl Grapefruit Radler is tasty, it's just a mix of half grapefruit soda and half lager. (I don't know if you know this, but a radler is like a shandy: a mix of soda and beer. And I agree with your opinion of Leinie's Summer Shandy.) It's easy enough to make on your own, although that particular version is the best commercially available shandy/radler I've had.

    Yes, please come back with tasting notes on what you tried. My suggestions were easy-to-find and middle-of-the-road to get a sense of what you like out of low(er) hopped beers. The St. Bernardus/Rochefort is a fun little experiment.
  • Post #18 - August 17th, 2012, 11:09 am
    Post #18 - August 17th, 2012, 11:09 am Post #18 - August 17th, 2012, 11:09 am
    Unfortunately I will be at Leona's on Saturday, but they do have a Hoegaarden and Ebel's Weiss. That will likely be where I start. I will indeed update my findings!
    I want to have a good body, but not as much as I want dessert. ~ Jason Love

    There is no pie in Nighthawks, which is why it's such a desolate image. ~ Happy Stomach

    I write stuff.
  • Post #19 - August 17th, 2012, 12:29 pm
    Post #19 - August 17th, 2012, 12:29 pm Post #19 - August 17th, 2012, 12:29 pm
    Looking at their beer menu, Domaine DuPage and Leffe Blond would also be worth checking out. There's kind of a long-shot that you might enjoy Boddington's, too. You seem to like the general beer profile from Britain and Ireland. I kind of think of Boddingtons as a watered-down Guinness. It's not a super-accurate description, but if you have a taste of it, I think you'll understand what I'm getting at.
  • Post #20 - August 18th, 2012, 9:14 pm
    Post #20 - August 18th, 2012, 9:14 pm Post #20 - August 18th, 2012, 9:14 pm
    Taste in beer is such an individual thing, everybody has their own unique preferences. It is nearly impossible for somebody else to predict what your flavor preferences might be. You really need to experiment on yourself to search out your niche. Almost all beer is made from the same 4 ingredients(water, malted barley,hops, yeast). Nevertheless, the proportions and types of those ingredients coupled with different brewing techniques produce a seemingly infinite plethora of flavor profiles, with new ones coming out all the time. Even life-long beer drinkers are constantly sampling new brands and varieties. Discovering new flavors and variations is one of the things that makes beer drinking enjoyable (at least it makes a good excuse for having "just one more").

    The universe of brewed beverages is so vast, that it is somewhat overwhelming and difficult to navigate for newcomers. First, you should sample different styles of beer (pilsener, stout, porter, pale ale etc.). Then you need to obtain samples of different brands and interpretations of those styles. A store that allows you to mix six packs could be really helpful there. Better yet, I'll bet if you went into the Map Room on a slow weekday afternoon, and explained to the bartender that you are new to the world of malted beverages, and want to find out what flavors you might prefer, they will gladly let you sample different styles on draft (they have about 2 dozen). If they are not that busy, they will probably also help guide you through the process of narrowing your search by suggesting brews you might like. I have seen people do this there many times. The Map Room has some of the most beer knowledgeable employees (and customers) in the Midwest, and they love to talk beer.

    Anyhow, it seems by your comments that you lean towards the more malty side of the flavor spectrum. There are two different families of malt, one that provides sugar for the yeast to digest, the other that contributes to the flavor and color of the brew. The first type determines both the alcohol content and the level of sweetness. The more sugar that is digested by the yeast, the more alcohol is produced and less residual sugars are left to sweeten the beer. The amount of alcohol that is produced and the amount of residual sugars that are left is largely determined by the strain of yeast and the temperature that the malt is steeped at. That is why Pale Ales tend to be high in alcohol but less sweet while stouts tend to be lower in alcohol but much sweeter. New brewing techniques and strains of yeast have made this rule less steadfast. In fact, up until recently, American brewers seemed to be in competition to produce the most alcoholic brew by breeding strains of super yeast. I don't like such potent brews, because you get too drunk too fast to enjoy your beer drinking session.

    The second type of malt provides color and flavor to the brew, as well as texture. Colors and texture can range from pale yellow and watery to pitch black and molasses-like. These flavors can be candy-like and sweeter like chocolate and vanilla or have a roasted bitterness like coffee or burnt toast. There are even some smoked malts that impart a baconesque flavor.

    There are also two families of hops, the types that make the beer bitter (like Columbus), and the types that give it its aroma (Like Kent Goldings). Some hops strains (like Cascade) can do both, depending on how long they are allowed to boil. Hops that are higher in Alpha-acid are more bitter, which is why 3 Floyd's Alpha King has its name. The longer hops is allowed to boil, the more Alpha-acid is released, making the beer more bitter. That is what Dogfish Head's 120 Minute Ale refers to. Like with the competition to produce the strongest beer, a while back there was a lot of competition among American brewers to produce the most hoppy and bitter beer. Some began adding additional hops to the beer after brewing, during the fermentation phase (called dry hopping). Some even added concentrated hop juice to the beer after it was brewed. Thankfully, craft brewers have matured lately, and are concentrating on other flavors beyond dish soap. Judging by your remarks, you would not like these hop-filled beers, but you do not need to steer clear of hops completely. Instead try beers that use less bittering hops and more aroma hops. Some aroma hops can impart a sweet and flowery bouquet to the beer, reminiscent of apple or peach blossoms. To simplify this part of your search, the bitterness of beer is actually measured using a scale called International Bittering Units (IBU). Here is a link to a chart of different styles and their IBU range: http://www.islandbeerclub.com/ibuchart.htm .

    Finally, beer can have additional ingredients that provide a unique flavor such as berries and other fruit (or grapefruit) or coffee and even pumpkin. Some beers have added spices, herbs and other plants like dandelions, cloves or juniper berries. A beer might also have added grains like wheat and rye (I really like rye beers but dislike wheat). Again, breweries seem to be currently competing to produce beer with the most bizarre adjunct flavors. Some of these, like a mole flavored beer I sampled (the sauce, not the animal) are truly awful. When it comes to adjunct ingredients, I prefer a lighter touch. Taking in all these flavor factors, I think you might like Bell's Cherry Stout which has a chocolatey and fruity flavor, but is not overly sweet or alcoholic (like me). It is a rich beer though, and you probably won't want more than one glass (it is nice with desert). On the lighter side, there is a Belgian wheat beer (whose name escapes me), that has lemon added. It is really light and refreshing without being diluted and watery tasting.

    Sorry to prattle on. I didn't intend to be so pedantic, but I hope this helps a little. At any rate, have fun on your adventure, and make sure you have a ride home. Speaking of which, I don't know if it was mentioned earlier, but "Radler" means "wheeler" and refers to bicyclists who enjoy a refreshing mixture of cold beer and lemonade to cool off while bike-riding on hot summer days.
  • Post #21 - August 19th, 2012, 9:59 am
    Post #21 - August 19th, 2012, 9:59 am Post #21 - August 19th, 2012, 9:59 am
    That's a very helpful post! Thanks! I'll have to give that website a good look too, and ditch work one of these days for an afternoon at The Maproom.
    I want to have a good body, but not as much as I want dessert. ~ Jason Love

    There is no pie in Nighthawks, which is why it's such a desolate image. ~ Happy Stomach

    I write stuff.
  • Post #22 - August 19th, 2012, 5:08 pm
    Post #22 - August 19th, 2012, 5:08 pm Post #22 - August 19th, 2012, 5:08 pm
    Pie Lady wrote:That's a very helpful post! Thanks! I'll have to give that website a good look too, and ditch work one of these days for an afternoon at The Maproom.


    Be aware, though, that a straight IBU number may not match your perception of a beer's bitterness. There's a delicate dance between hops and malt. If a beer is very malty, it generally requires more hops to balance the malt's sweetness. If a beer is not very malty, than a middling level of hops may be perceived as quite hoppy. For example, I've had a lot of people complain about a basic pilsner's level of hoppiness, at 30-40 IBUs, while not noticing the hops in a porter that has 50-60+ IBUs, because the malty sweetness more than balances the hoppiness.
  • Post #23 - August 19th, 2012, 6:38 pm
    Post #23 - August 19th, 2012, 6:38 pm Post #23 - August 19th, 2012, 6:38 pm
    Binko wrote:
    Pie Lady wrote:That's a very helpful post! Thanks! I'll have to give that website a good look too, and ditch work one of these days for an afternoon at The Maproom.


    Be aware, though, that a straight IBU number may not match your perception of a beer's bitterness. There's a delicate dance between hops and malt. If a beer is very malty, it generally requires more hops to balance the malt's sweetness. If a beer is not very malty, than a middling level of hops may be perceived as quite hoppy. For example, I've had a lot of people complain about a basic pilsner's level of hoppiness, at 30-40 IBUs, while not noticing the hops in a porter that has 50-60+ IBUs, because the malty sweetness more than balances the hoppiness.
    Good point. The other component to consider is the amount of residual sugar left after fermentation. While that number is always listed for wines, it is hard to find it for most beers. The alcohol content (ABV) and acidity (PH) also affect the perceived bitterness. Barley Wines which usually top the IBU chart don't generally taste as bitter as their number would indicate, because they are so malty and high in alcohol. It would be interesting to have a scale based on the ratio of IBU:residual sugar, and see how that affects people's likes or dislikes (or even IBU:ABV:residual sugar) . The IBU also doesn't consider any added flavorings that may affect the bitterness or sweetness. Still, it is a good place to start if you know you either like or dislike bitter beers.
  • Post #24 - August 20th, 2012, 1:07 pm
    Post #24 - August 20th, 2012, 1:07 pm Post #24 - August 20th, 2012, 1:07 pm
    d4v3 wrote:While that number is always listed for wines, it is hard to find it for most beers.


    Where do you find those wine numbers for residual sugar? I've always just kinda tried to guess based on ABV.
  • Post #25 - August 20th, 2012, 1:53 pm
    Post #25 - August 20th, 2012, 1:53 pm Post #25 - August 20th, 2012, 1:53 pm
    My weekend drinking did not work out as planned, and the booze cruse planned for tonight at Navy Pier was sold out. So I'll have to wait, but I printed up a nice long Word document that I'll keep in my purse.
    I want to have a good body, but not as much as I want dessert. ~ Jason Love

    There is no pie in Nighthawks, which is why it's such a desolate image. ~ Happy Stomach

    I write stuff.
  • Post #26 - August 20th, 2012, 7:35 pm
    Post #26 - August 20th, 2012, 7:35 pm Post #26 - August 20th, 2012, 7:35 pm
    Give the Samuel Smith's Organic Apricot a try at some point - it has a very strong apricot flavor, and is popular with a few friends who generally avoid beer.
  • Post #27 - August 21st, 2012, 4:10 pm
    Post #27 - August 21st, 2012, 4:10 pm Post #27 - August 21st, 2012, 4:10 pm
    Binko wrote:
    d4v3 wrote:While that number is always listed for wines, it is hard to find it for most beers.

    Where do you find those wine numbers for residual sugar? I've always just kinda tried to guess based on ABV.
    I have seen it expressed as degrees of Brix(based on the specific gravity) on vintner's websites and in wine reviews. Although when I went looking for examples, I could only find a couple. I guess it is not as common as I thought. ABV helps only if you know the original specific gravity brefore fermentation, which a winemaker is probably reluctant to divulge.
  • Post #28 - August 22nd, 2012, 7:56 am
    Post #28 - August 22nd, 2012, 7:56 am Post #28 - August 22nd, 2012, 7:56 am
    Tried Moose Drool (brown ale) by Big Sky Brewing. No me gusta.
    I want to have a good body, but not as much as I want dessert. ~ Jason Love

    There is no pie in Nighthawks, which is why it's such a desolate image. ~ Happy Stomach

    I write stuff.
  • Post #29 - August 22nd, 2012, 5:20 pm
    Post #29 - August 22nd, 2012, 5:20 pm Post #29 - August 22nd, 2012, 5:20 pm
    d4v3 wrote: ABV helps only if you know the original specific gravity brefore fermentation, which a winemaker is probably reluctant to divulge.


    Sure, but you can make a reasonable guess. If your wine is 14% ABV, you can bet the house that is has very little residual sugar and is very dry. Conversely, if you're in the high single digits or low doubles, you're probably looking at a very sweet wine. That's what I mean by I try to guess based on ABV. There may be some exceptions, but in general, if you see a wine in the 9-11% ABV range, it's probably on the sweeter side. If you see 12.5+%, you're probably looking at something fairly dry.
  • Post #30 - August 23rd, 2012, 5:29 pm
    Post #30 - August 23rd, 2012, 5:29 pm Post #30 - August 23rd, 2012, 5:29 pm
    Binko wrote:
    d4v3 wrote: ABV helps only if you know the original specific gravity brefore fermentation, which a winemaker is probably reluctant to divulge.


    Sure, but you can make a reasonable guess. If your wine is 14% ABV, you can bet the house that is has very little residual sugar and is very dry. Conversely, if you're in the high single digits or low doubles, you're probably looking at a very sweet wine. That's what I mean by I try to guess based on ABV. There may be some exceptions, but in general, if you see a wine in the 9-11% ABV range, it's probably on the sweeter side. If you see 12.5+%, you're probably looking at something fairly dry.

    Yeah that is the rule of thumb for beer too. The lower the ABV, the sweeter. With beer it is much harder because it depends on how much malt is used in proportion to the amount of water. With wine, the grape juice already has the water, so assuming no additional water or sugar is added, the Original Gravity is probably pretty close to an average for each type of grape used. When comparing two wines made from the same varietals, the ABV will give you a pretty good indication of sweetness.

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