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Vienna Natural Casing+Skinless Hot Dog = False Advertising?

Vienna Natural Casing+Skinless Hot Dog = False Advertising?
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  • Vienna Natural Casing+Skinless Hot Dog = False Advertising?

    Post #1 - February 17th, 2015, 3:34 pm
    Post #1 - February 17th, 2015, 3:34 pm Post #1 - February 17th, 2015, 3:34 pm
    Many of us know the familiar scene. You want a Vienna Beef hot dog and you see the classic picture on the wall of the hot dog joint. You see that beautiful curved natural casing dog in the picture and can't wait to get one. Then you look at the hot dog you are served and your heart melts as you are looking at a straight, skinless Vienna hot dog. Sure, it will have that great taste, but it's not the same.

    The offending sign that is used to lure you in:
    Image

    So my main question is this: Is that false advertising? Of course I don't mean the exact presentation of the hot dog as depicted in the picture (as one desperate and not too bright employee at a guilty establishment tried to debate with me). I pointed out that they were advertising to me that they sell a natural casing hot dog. Instead, they're selling me a skinless hot dog.

    A second question: Should Vienna be required to change the posters and signs at these locations? I wonder if they even care (probably not). Who would be to blame? Vienna with their head in the sand? Vienna encouraging this? The store itself trying to pull a fast one? Ignorant Vienna employee and ignorant owner who have no clue what the difference is? Thoughts?
  • Post #2 - February 17th, 2015, 3:44 pm
    Post #2 - February 17th, 2015, 3:44 pm Post #2 - February 17th, 2015, 3:44 pm
    Take it up with your alderman.
  • Post #3 - February 17th, 2015, 4:12 pm
    Post #3 - February 17th, 2015, 4:12 pm Post #3 - February 17th, 2015, 4:12 pm
    Worse than that is being lied to upon asking. This happened to me at Mangis Fast Foods at Lincoln and Grace. Imagine my horror to bite into a skinless dog thinking it was going to be natural casing! I still have nightmares!
    Part of the secret of a success in life is to eat what you like and let the food fight it out inside.

    -Mark Twain
  • Post #4 - February 17th, 2015, 5:09 pm
    Post #4 - February 17th, 2015, 5:09 pm Post #4 - February 17th, 2015, 5:09 pm
    laikom wrote:Worse than that is being lied to upon asking. This happened to me at Mangis Fast Foods at Lincoln and Grace. Imagine my horror to bite into a skinless dog thinking it was going to be natural casing! I still have nightmares!
    :lol:
  • Post #5 - February 17th, 2015, 5:54 pm
    Post #5 - February 17th, 2015, 5:54 pm Post #5 - February 17th, 2015, 5:54 pm
    This is the first time I've ever heard of a product being slightly different from the photo used to advertise/promote it.

    .
    .
    .

    Well, maybe not the first.
  • Post #6 - February 18th, 2015, 7:22 am
    Post #6 - February 18th, 2015, 7:22 am Post #6 - February 18th, 2015, 7:22 am
    Vienna makes both skinless and natural casing, don't know if they make two different signs, both contain the same blend.
    Take yourself down to the Vienna Factory store and purchase a box of natural casing dogs and freeze.
    That's what I do.
    Or get the iPhone Vienna Beef App for vendor locations for prepared Vienna Beef hotdogs and other information.
    Then call your alderman! :D -Dick
  • Post #7 - February 18th, 2015, 7:41 am
    Post #7 - February 18th, 2015, 7:41 am Post #7 - February 18th, 2015, 7:41 am
    Natural casing only please!

    If I was stranded on a desert island and the only food source was a hot dog stand that sold skinless wieners I'd eat them, but that is the one scenario I can think of, at least at the moment.

    Actually, that is not true, I occasionally have a dog at Superdawg, which are skinless. Like the spicing, like the crisp crinkle cut fries, like the cucumber pickle, love the pickled green tomato and the roof top hot dogs Morrie & Florrie.

    Image
    Image
    One minute to Wapner.
    Raymond Babbitt

    Low & Slow
  • Post #8 - February 18th, 2015, 9:19 am
    Post #8 - February 18th, 2015, 9:19 am Post #8 - February 18th, 2015, 9:19 am
    budrichard wrote:Vienna makes both skinless and natural casing, don't know if they make two different signs, both contain the same blend.
    Take yourself down to the Vienna Factory store and purchase a box of natural casing dogs and freeze.
    That's what I do.
    Or get the iPhone Vienna Beef App for vendor locations for prepared Vienna Beef hotdogs and other information.
    Then call your alderman! :D -Dick
    There are two different signs, but I couldn't find the skinless one online. I have done the case of Vienna hot dogs and freezing them which is always a great idea. But I'm not asking for a solution for myself. I just want to know if this is false advertising and should it be allowed?

    Gary, I've never been a fan of Superdawg. And I love the whole Americana aspect of it, so you'd think I would.
  • Post #9 - February 19th, 2015, 11:57 am
    Post #9 - February 19th, 2015, 11:57 am Post #9 - February 19th, 2015, 11:57 am
    In the overall scheme of things, this is 'small potatoes'.
    Should it be allowed?
    I don't think there is much you can do.-Dick
  • Post #10 - February 21st, 2015, 4:36 pm
    Post #10 - February 21st, 2015, 4:36 pm Post #10 - February 21st, 2015, 4:36 pm
    I remember last year the Vienna Beef stated they would start selling natural casing in stores (not just butcher shops). Obviously I've yet to find them.
  • Post #11 - February 21st, 2015, 5:10 pm
    Post #11 - February 21st, 2015, 5:10 pm Post #11 - February 21st, 2015, 5:10 pm
    beefsandwich1 wrote:I remember last year the Vienna Beef stated they would start selling natural casing in stores (not just butcher shops). Obviously I've yet to find them.


    I've seen 'em around. Check Fresh Farms in Niles. I think that's where I saw them.
    Steve Z.

    “Only the pure in heart can make a good soup.”
    ― Ludwig van Beethoven
  • Post #12 - February 21st, 2015, 6:15 pm
    Post #12 - February 21st, 2015, 6:15 pm Post #12 - February 21st, 2015, 6:15 pm
    Ram4 wrote:There are two different signs, but I couldn't find the skinless one online. I have done the case of Vienna hot dogs and freezing them which is always a great idea. But I'm not asking for a solution for myself. I just want to know if this is false advertising and should it be allowed?


    The only variation I ever remember seeing is a "depression dog" sign that has a non-poppy seed bun, mustard, onion, and relish on it. Something like this. (There's also the hand drawn signs, but I'm talking about the photograph signs.) I've never seen a skinless sign, and I doubt 99% of consumers even notice that detail.

    To me, the sign merely means they sell Vienna Beef products. They may come fully dressed to-Vienna-Beef-Chicago-style-specs; they may not. They may come on a poppyseed bun; they may not. It's not a sign I personally interpret to mean that that is exactly the way the hot dog is served to you. I personally don't see it as false advertising, though I can see a valid argument that it can be construed as false advertising.
  • Post #13 - February 22nd, 2015, 3:01 pm
    Post #13 - February 22nd, 2015, 3:01 pm Post #13 - February 22nd, 2015, 3:01 pm
    Ram4 wrote:Many of us know the familiar scene. You want a Vienna Beef hot dog and you see the classic picture on the wall of the hot dog joint. You see that beautiful curved natural casing dog in the picture and can't wait to get one. Then you look at the hot dog you are served and your heart melts as you are looking at a straight, skinless Vienna hot dog. Sure, it will have that great taste, but it's not the same.

    The offending sign that is used to lure you in:
    Image

    So my main question is this: Is that false advertising? Of course I don't mean the exact presentation of the hot dog as depicted in the picture (as one desperate and not too bright employee at a guilty establishment tried to debate with me). I pointed out that they were advertising to me that they sell a natural casing hot dog. Instead, they're selling me a skinless hot dog.

    A second question: Should Vienna be required to change the posters and signs at these locations? I wonder if they even care (probably not). Who would be to blame? Vienna with their head in the sand? Vienna encouraging this? The store itself trying to pull a fast one? Ignorant Vienna employee and ignorant owner who have no clue what the difference is? Thoughts?

    I don't think this is anyone's fault or false advertising. Vienna makes both skinless and natural casing dogs and apparenty, their signs depict one type or another. But wouldn't it just be easy enough to ask before you order whether the dog is skinless or natural casing?

    =R=
    Gardening is a bloodsport --Meghan Kleeman

    Why don't you take these profiteroles and put them up your shi'-ta-holes? --Jemaine & Bret

    There's a horse loose in a hospital --JM

    That don't impress me much --Shania Twain
  • Post #14 - February 22nd, 2015, 3:37 pm
    Post #14 - February 22nd, 2015, 3:37 pm Post #14 - February 22nd, 2015, 3:37 pm
    Binko wrote:To me, the sign merely means they sell Vienna Beef products. They may come fully dressed to-Vienna-Beef-Chicago-style-specs; they may not. They may come on a poppyseed bun; they may not. It's not a sign I personally interpret to mean that that is exactly the way the hot dog is served to you. I personally don't see it as false advertising, though I can see a valid argument that it can be construed as false advertising.

    Bingo, Binko! :lol:
  • Post #15 - February 22nd, 2015, 10:21 pm
    Post #15 - February 22nd, 2015, 10:21 pm Post #15 - February 22nd, 2015, 10:21 pm
    Ram4 wrote:Many of us know the familiar scene. You want a Vienna Beef hot dog and you see the classic picture on the wall of the hot dog joint. You see that beautiful curved natural casing dog in the picture and can't wait to get one. Then you look at the hot dog you are served and your heart melts as you are looking at a straight, skinless Vienna hot dog. Sure, it will have that great taste, but it's not the same.

    The offending sign that is used to lure you in:
    Image

    So my main question is this: Is that false advertising? Of course I don't mean the exact presentation of the hot dog as depicted in the picture (as one desperate and not too bright employee at a guilty establishment tried to debate with me). I pointed out that they were advertising to me that they sell a natural casing hot dog. Instead, they're selling me a skinless hot dog.

    A second question: Should Vienna be required to change the posters and signs at these locations? I wonder if they even care (probably not). Who would be to blame? Vienna with their head in the sand? Vienna encouraging this? The store itself trying to pull a fast one? Ignorant Vienna employee and ignorant owner who have no clue what the difference is? Thoughts?

    You may have missed my response to your earlier posts.

    Back in July 2012, in the Hot Dogs in Duneland thread Rene G wrote:
    Ram4 wrote:All I see are skinless hot dogs. :x I hate it when I see a Vienna Beef hot dog sign showing the real thing and they give you what you showed here.

    In another thread Ram4 wrote:I told the owner it was B.S. that he has Vienna beef signs showing natural casing hot dogs but serves the store bought version with frozen fries.

    What signs are you referring to? In the Vienna Beef signs I'm familiar with, the sausage ends have been so thoroughly retouched that it's unclear (to me at least) if there's a casing or not.

    Image

    Likewise, one can't really judge the hue of the relish or tell if the pickle is a disk or a spear. It's a minor masterpiece of visual ambiguity. Or is there another sign you meant?

    Now I realize it's the frankfurter's curvature, not its ends, you are focusing on. I don't disagree at all that natural casing sausages tend to curve during cooking more often than do skinless ones. But sometimes you'll see natural casing ones that are straight as an arrow and skinless ones that adopt a gentle arc. Here's a natural casing wiener from Portillo's that looks pretty straight to me.

    Image

    And here's a group portrait of some skinless dogs (not Vienna) on the griddle at Coney Island Wiener Stand in Fort Wayne.

    Image

    Granted, most are straight but you can see some curving a bit to mimic their skinned cousins. If the correlation were always perfect, your argument for deceptive advertising would be stronger. I guess all I'm trying to say is, good luck trying to find a lawyer willing to take your case.

    beefsandwich1 wrote:I remember last year the Vienna Beef stated they would start selling natural casing in stores (not just butcher shops). Obviously I've yet to find them.

    They've been in supermarkets for a while now. I first noticed them at Treasure Island in February 2013. It wasn't simply a one-time occurrence, but they don't seem to be regularly stocked.

    Image

    The shot above shows them for sale at Jewel, mainly to illustrate what the package looks like (does the picture on the label certify they're natural casing?). I so rarely shop at Jewel that I have no idea how often they have them.
  • Post #16 - February 24th, 2015, 1:26 pm
    Post #16 - February 24th, 2015, 1:26 pm Post #16 - February 24th, 2015, 1:26 pm
    Thank you for digging into the past Rene, good job! I am positive at some point I have seen a sign that had a skinless Vienna on it, and I will try to find it.

    Ronnie - I always ask if they have natural casing, I'm sick of being let down.

    So technically, yes it's false advertising, but I guess most people are either oblivious, or don't care.
  • Post #17 - February 24th, 2015, 1:29 pm
    Post #17 - February 24th, 2015, 1:29 pm Post #17 - February 24th, 2015, 1:29 pm
    Ram4 wrote:So technically, yes it's false advertising, but I guess most people are either oblivious, or don't care.

    Given everything posted here, I find this to be a strange conclusion. Seems more like non-specific advertising would be more accurate.

    =R=
    Gardening is a bloodsport --Meghan Kleeman

    Why don't you take these profiteroles and put them up your shi'-ta-holes? --Jemaine & Bret

    There's a horse loose in a hospital --JM

    That don't impress me much --Shania Twain
  • Post #18 - February 24th, 2015, 1:38 pm
    Post #18 - February 24th, 2015, 1:38 pm Post #18 - February 24th, 2015, 1:38 pm
    stevez wrote:
    beefsandwich1 wrote:I remember last year the Vienna Beef stated they would start selling natural casing in stores (not just butcher shops). Obviously I've yet to find them.


    I've seen 'em around. Check Fresh Farms in Niles. I think that's where I saw them.
    I heard that Vienna discontinued them at the grocery stores. I know Jewel no longer carries them. I once saw a nice package of 16 natural casing Vienna hot dogs at Costco. Never saw it again. There's always the factory.
  • Post #19 - February 24th, 2015, 1:43 pm
    Post #19 - February 24th, 2015, 1:43 pm Post #19 - February 24th, 2015, 1:43 pm
    ronnie_suburban wrote:
    Ram4 wrote:So technically, yes it's false advertising, but I guess most people are either oblivious, or don't care.

    Given everything posted here, I find this to be a strange conclusion. Seems more like non-specific advertising would be more accurate.

    =R=

    Well it depends on who's responsible. Wouldn't you think a Natural Casing hot dog would be more expensive than the a skinless one? Vienna can claim they are just displaying a sign for all hot dogs, but I don't believe it. Maybe our friend who runs Hot Dog U can chime in on this?

    By the way, I found this picture with a skinless hot dog, it's from Vienna's phone app. Not sure if it's available as a poster.
    Image
  • Post #20 - February 24th, 2015, 2:32 pm
    Post #20 - February 24th, 2015, 2:32 pm Post #20 - February 24th, 2015, 2:32 pm
    Image
    Mark A Reitman, PhD
    Professor of Hot Dogs
    Hot Dog University/Vienna Beef
  • Post #21 - February 24th, 2015, 2:54 pm
    Post #21 - February 24th, 2015, 2:54 pm Post #21 - February 24th, 2015, 2:54 pm
    chicagostyledog wrote:Image

    Ceci n'est pas une chien boyau naturel.
  • Post #22 - February 24th, 2015, 4:07 pm
    Post #22 - February 24th, 2015, 4:07 pm Post #22 - February 24th, 2015, 4:07 pm
    RAB wrote:
    chicagostyledog wrote:Image

    Ceci n'est pas une chien boyau naturel.


    Deux personnes peuvent regarder la meme image et voir differentes images. The artist's rendition of the hot dog determines the observer's prospective.
    Last edited by chicagostyledog on February 24th, 2015, 7:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
    Mark A Reitman, PhD
    Professor of Hot Dogs
    Hot Dog University/Vienna Beef
  • Post #23 - February 24th, 2015, 4:37 pm
    Post #23 - February 24th, 2015, 4:37 pm Post #23 - February 24th, 2015, 4:37 pm
    Ram4 wrote:By the way, I found this picture with a skinless hot dog, it's from Vienna's phone app. Not sure if it's available as a poster.
    Image

    And that's the same picture as the one above, with the ends retouched, rotated, and put on a red background.
    Look closely at the pickles, the peppers, the mustard splotch, even the poppy seed pattern: it's the same darn dog.
    What is patriotism, but the love of good things we ate in our childhood?
    -- Lin Yutang
  • Post #24 - August 31st, 2015, 12:17 pm
    Post #24 - August 31st, 2015, 12:17 pm Post #24 - August 31st, 2015, 12:17 pm
    But where can I buy the NCs on a normal basis? Besides going to the Vienna Beef store. Any locations on the south side or close to?
    #SOUTHSIDESLITHER
  • Post #25 - May 19th, 2019, 10:29 am
    Post #25 - May 19th, 2019, 10:29 am Post #25 - May 19th, 2019, 10:29 am
    chicagotribune.com wrote:Some versions of the official hot dog of Chicago — Vienna Beef — have been officially recalled.

    Chicago-based Vienna Beef recalled 2,030 pounds of hot dog products, according to a news release from the U.S. Department of Agriculture Food Safety and Inspection Service. The franks were found to be contaminated with foreign matter, including metal it said.

    No reports of illness from consumption of the product have been reported, the agency said.

    The following products are subject to recall:

    10-lb. cases containing “Skinless Beef Frankfurters 6” 8’s 10#” with case code 013180 and package code 9122 represented on the label.
    10-lb. cases containing “Skinless Beef Frankfurters 6” 11’s 10#” with case code 013312 and package code 9122 or 9123 represented on the label.
    10-lb. cases containing “Skinless Beef Frankfurters 7” 9’s 10#” with case code 013490 and package code 9122 or 9123 represented on the label.

    The products were produced on May 2 and shipped to service locations in Illinois, Indiana and Wisconsin.

    The agency is concerned that some product may be in food service refrigerators or freezers. The food safety organization urged businesses to inspect their products and throw away or return any infected product to vendors.

    These products should be thrown away or returned to the place of purchase.

    Vienna Beef recalled for possible metal contamination

    =R=
    Gardening is a bloodsport --Meghan Kleeman

    Why don't you take these profiteroles and put them up your shi'-ta-holes? --Jemaine & Bret

    There's a horse loose in a hospital --JM

    That don't impress me much --Shania Twain
  • Post #26 - May 19th, 2019, 1:52 pm
    Post #26 - May 19th, 2019, 1:52 pm Post #26 - May 19th, 2019, 1:52 pm
    ronnie_suburban wrote:
    chicagotribune.com wrote:Some versions of the official hot dog of Chicago — Vienna Beef — have been officially recalled.

    Chicago-based Vienna Beef recalled 2,030 pounds of hot dog products, according to a news release from the U.S. Department of Agriculture Food Safety and Inspection Service. The franks were found to be contaminated with foreign matter, including metal it said.

    No reports of illness from consumption of the product have been reported, the agency said.

    The following products are subject to recall:

    10-lb. cases containing “Skinless Beef Frankfurters 6” 8’s 10#” with case code 013180 and package code 9122 represented on the label.
    10-lb. cases containing “Skinless Beef Frankfurters 6” 11’s 10#” with case code 013312 and package code 9122 or 9123 represented on the label.
    10-lb. cases containing “Skinless Beef Frankfurters 7” 9’s 10#” with case code 013490 and package code 9122 or 9123 represented on the label.

    The products were produced on May 2 and shipped to service locations in Illinois, Indiana and Wisconsin.

    The agency is concerned that some product may be in food service refrigerators or freezers. The food safety organization urged businesses to inspect their products and throw away or return any infected product to vendors.

    These products should be thrown away or returned to the place of purchase.

    Vienna Beef recalled for possible metal contamination

    =R=

    Yet further reinforcement that one should only order the natural casing dogs! :twisted:
    Objects in mirror appear to be losing.

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