Those Carolina Reapers have been around for awhile now. We looked at stocking these at The Spice House about ten years ago, but they were only being grown by a few small farms, not enough to meet commercial demands. I think any pepper claiming to be the hottest ever will always come under scrutiny, as there are ways to skew the results. It sometimes happens with peppers claiming to be the hottest that a sample gets cherry picked to include the select few will hit that crazy high scoville heat rating which would substantiate the claim. Yet when a much larger overall sample is the gauge, this was not the case.

It was interesting to read about how difficult it is to work with these peppers, which we understand in moderation from our shop experience. When we weigh any of the hot peppers featured in the title of this forum, we take them into the ventilated blending room to weigh them for the customer, so that we don't choke all the other customers. There wast a period of time when we could not get ground habanero chile peppers. We love these hot peppers more than any other because in addition to heat, their fruity flavor shines through. We don't really understand the point of heat without flavor. The man who had done the grinding of the habanero chile peppers at our source, for many, many years, had died. A series of new grinders were hired, who rarely lasted the week. We went almost a year without ground habanero peppers before they eventually found a replacement grinder. We were afraid to ask the details, hopefully they tripled the pay!

Cathy2 wrote:Do you have any idea how much once must ingest to get this level of reaction from your body?

Anecdotal evidence suggests only extreme amounts of the hottest peppers affect hearing. Let's see how that fits with some quick-and-dirty calculations...

Capsaicin's effects on outer hair cells seem to be exerted in the concentration range of micromoles per liter. In the Wu et al paper, capsaicin was used at 300 μM, a concentration with near maximal effect, I think; somewhat different experiments reported in an earlier paper used 20 μM, but I'm not sure what the lower limit is. A quick look at the chile literature (Canto-Flick et al, 2008) shows that some of the hottest habaneros contain 60 milligrams capsaicin per gram of dry chile weight (these chiles register about 900,000 Scoville units). The molecular weight of capsaicin is 305 g/mol, so that makes it 0.2 mmol capsaicin per dry gram. The average North American weighs about 80 kg, about 60% (50 kg) of which is water. So, if you were to uniformly dissolve the capsaicin from 25 g (nearly 1 ounce) of dried super-hot habaneros in a 50 liter sack of water, that's 5 mmol per 50 liters = 0.1 mM = 100 μM.

Obviously there are enough baseless assumptions and unknowns (eg, how efficiently is capsaicin absorbed? is capsaicin concentrated in or excluded from the inner ear?) so as to make such calculations nearly worthless, but achieving micromolar-range capsaicin concentrations in the human body, and perhaps in the inner ear, doesn't seem out of the question.

Cathy2 wrote:Could a person more sensitive to capsaicin have this reaction at a much lower level of consumption?

The main point of the Wu et al paper is that capsaicin's effect on the outer hair cells is not mediated through the capsaicin receptor (which does mediate the "hot" response when eating chiles). For that reason, I wouldn't expect an individual who's especially sensitive to heat in chiles to necessarily be especially susceptible to capsaicin's effect on hearing. It's a complex system, though, and I'm getting pretty far outside my scientific comfort zone. Even with that disclaimer, I feel quite confident saying you're unlikely to go deaf if you happen to accidentally get a small piece of bird's eye chile while eating a Thai meal!

Cinnamon Girl wrote:It was interesting to read about how difficult it is to work with these peppers, which we understand in moderation from our shop experience. When we weigh any of the hot peppers featured in the title of this forum, we take them into the ventilated blending room to weigh them for the customer, so that we don't choke all the other customers. There wast a period of time when we could not get ground habanero chile peppers. We love these hot peppers more than any other because in addition to heat, their fruity flavor shines through. We don't really understand the point of heat without flavor. The man who had done the grinding of the habanero chile peppers at our source, for many, many years, had died. A series of new grinders were hired, who rarely lasted the week. We went almost a year without ground habanero peppers before they eventually found a replacement grinder. We were afraid to ask the details, hopefully they tripled the pay!

Interesting stories! I didn't realize you need to take such precautions with Aleppo and Urfa peppers. I used to get ground habanero (yes, great stuff; I need to stop by for more) from your store and think I remember when it became unavailable. Now I know why. I wonder how the old habanero grinder's hearing was before he died. It may not be possible to inhale enough to affect hearing, but who knows the effects of chronic exposure. Even though they're natural products, in large quantities chiles can have significant pharmacological effects.

I am wondering about the statement in the "death noodles" article that "some locals can even finish a whole plate, which is crazy." One fellow LTH-er told me that after going on a hot food jag for an extended period, he lost the response to capsaicin, which he missed terribly. The sensation was restored, however, after a long period of abstinence (to his great relief). It could be that the aforementioned "locals" develop a physical tolerance to the effects of capsaicin.

What say you, Rene G? Does this stack up? It would certainly undercut the macho claims of chile head stuntmen if the ability to eat such hot food were no longer seen as a matter of toughness.

Josephine wrote:It could be that the aforementioned "locals" develop a physical tolerance to the effects of capsaicin.

What say you, Rene G?

I don’t think there’s much question that acquired capsaicin tolerance is a real phenomenon, but it’s a complicated area at the intersection of receptor biochemistry and neurobiology (and other fields I’m not particularly comfortable with).

This short article from The Guardian is a fun introduction to chile science. The following quote from Arpad Szallasi, a respected capsaicin receptor researcher, might tell you all you want to know about the mechanism of capsaicin tolerance.

In The Guardian, Amy Fleming wrote:“Probably what happens,” says Szallasi, “is that you are exposed to high doses of chilli, and then your capsaicin-sensitive nerve endings in your nose and tongue send signals to the cell bodies, which then turn off the synthesis of this receptor. So the receptor disappears.” And if we stop eating chilli for a few days, the signal ceases and we start making the receptor again, hence our tolerance decreases.

If you want to read more, this Reddit discussion has some good information, some rather technical.

Finally, my concern expressed above for the old habanero grinder’s hearing was probably without scientific basis. Arpad Szallasi (quoted by Amy Fleming): “Chilli is very, very, very safe.”

Relatedly, Rene G - I'd love your thoughts on spicy tastes as a cramp preventer/reliever - per http://home.trainingpeaks.com/blog/arti ... cle-cramps

Rene G wrote:

Arpad Szallasi (quoted by Amy Fleming): “Chilli is very, very, very safe.”

Thanks for the link and the reassurance, Rene G, very interesting. I was not aware that receptors had the capacity to regenerate, especially that quickly. Fairly miraculous.

I'm reminded though, of this fellow in Xizhou, Yunnan, doing his grinding out of doors, as well as a story about a man who ground horseradish indoors, unawares, and was knocked to the floor!

leek wrote:Relatedly, Rene G - I'd love your thoughts on spicy tastes as a cramp preventer/reliever - per http://home.trainingpeaks.com/blog/arti ... cle-cramps

I wasn't aware of the cramp/capsaicin story before and have read only a little recently. There doesn't seem to be much written about it (and a fair bit of it is very poorly done), but this Wall Street Journal article* is probably the best source I found. As far as I can tell, no studies on the effectiveness of the treatment have been published (the July 2016 WSJ article mentions the work was presented at two scientific meetings, a good first step). This single page report from the HotShot website (it's a company that sells an anti-cramp elixir for about $6 a dose) has about the only data I could find. When superficially-described work presented by a company that profits from the sale of the product is the only ''science" to be found, that raises some red flags. So it's difficult to evaluate. If I were an athlete who suffered from cramping, I might give it a try before an event, but wouldn't be too surprised if it had no effect. It will be interesting to follow this story.

* If you can't access the article through the link, Google muscle cramps capsaicin and try accessing it from there.

Thanks much!

Rene G wrote:

leek wrote:Relatedly, Rene G - I'd love your thoughts on spicy tastes as a cramp preventer/reliever - per http://home.trainingpeaks.com/blog/arti ... cle-cramps

I wasn't aware of the cramp/capsaicin story before and have read only a little recently. There doesn't seem to be much written about it (and a fair bit of it is very poorly done), but this Wall Street Journal article* is probably the best source I found. As far as I can tell, no studies on the effectiveness of the treatment have been published (the July 2016 WSJ article mentions the work was presented at two scientific meetings, a good first step). This single page report from the HotShot website (it's a company that sells an anti-cramp elixir for about $6 a dose) has about the only data I could find. When superficially-described work presented by a company that profits from the sale of the product is the only ''science" to be found, that raises some red flags. So it's difficult to evaluate. If I were an athlete who suffered from cramping, I might give it a try before an event, but wouldn't be too surprised if it had no effect. It will be interesting to follow this story.

* If you can't access the article through the link, Google muscle cramps capsaicin and try accessing it from there.

Here's a comment for Cinammon Girl. I agree totally with you about the fruity flavour of habanero: why have hot without flavour?

On the other hand, it might very well be useful to have that same fruity flavour without the heat. Which, nicely enough, is exactly what one gets with rocotillo--http://sustainableseedco.com/heirloom-vegetable-seeds/pe-t/pepper-heirloom-seeds/hot-peppers/rocotillo-pepper-seeds.html.

I'm sure you already know about this, but I thought I should supply the reference in any case.

Funny story. When Jean Andrews' book on peppers first came out years ago, many of the peppers she described were cited and given a supplier/source in the appendix. But, for rocotillo--which she described as 'the best tasting pepper she'd ever tried'--there was no source listed. So, I wrote her, and cried "Foul! no fair leaving the best pepper you ever tasted unsourced!"

She responded with a tiny packet of ten seeds, which line I kept going for nearly two decades!! : )

Geo